America Unearthed Vikings in America
It's the morning after and already I'm receiving a flood of emails, including from academics, that it's an outrage the Noman's Land Island Rune Stone is not being rescued. This situation is similar to the Narragansett Rune Stone which is now in a temporary secure location until a permanent structure can be built to preserve and protect the artifact for future study. The same thing needs to happen with the Noman's Land stone. My understanding is an effort was started by residents on Martha's Vineyard, but it was squashed by the current State Archaeologist of Massachusetts, Brona Simon, a known opponent of anything suggesting pre-Columbian contact. Why she would have any objection to preserving what could very likely be a vital artifact of ancient American History is beyond me. The time to get that stone out of the surf and into a secure location is now!Nancy Millwood's stone is almost certainly genuine, but I don't think it's Viking in age. I suspect it's more likely medieval, probably carved sometime between 1200-1500 A.D. It reminds me of the Kensington and Spirit Pond rune Stones as it is filled with strange characters and numerous dotted runes. Like those inscriptions, the Millwood Rune Stone doesn't fit the standard runic traditions of Scandinavia, so understandably their translation was inconclusive. I was told that whoever tried to translate it (I still do not know who it was) eventually punted and said, "...it was probably modern." Why couldn't they have just said, "I don't know" and left it at that? That's OK too.
It's interesting that the inscription we featured that's certainly genuine, (although I suspect all three are) the Heavener Stone was by far the longest journey for a Norse party to travel. The route I like the best that we didn't suggest, taking the St. Lawrence southwest to the Allegheny River, then west on the Ohio to the Mississippi, would have been the shortest route. Regardless, the Heavener inscription stands as a testament that whatever Norse party carved it obviously got there.
Letter from a fan of America Unearthed:
To Scott Wolter & the America Unearthed team,
"The Viking Episode of America Unearthed was one of your best. I haven't been able to see every episode, but this one and last week's at the wall in Texas were excellent. It's beyond me why scientists could (finally, begrudgingly) accept that Vikings made it as far west as L'ance Aux Meadows, but in no way could have gone from L'ance Aux Meadows down to Northeastern America. As the one gentleman said, they had already travelled 1,300 miles, and getting to Martha's Vineyard from L'ance Aux Meadows is only another 1,200.
My favorite part of this episode of America Unearthed was Birgitta saying directly that L'ance Aux Meadows looked like a staging site for further exploration. Slam dunk.
Also, regarding the Smithsonian Institute not cooperating with anything that looks like ancient navigation to North America, didn't they lose some artifacts from the Bat Creek site in Tennessee?
Scott please keep up the great work on America Unearthed.
Thanks,
Jesse"
Scott and Birgitta inside the sod house at Lance Aux Meadows on June 12, 2013.
Somehow I was able to break off a chuck from this small iceberg for a round of drinks for the crew with special ice that floated all the way from Greenland.
Scott feeling very proud of his million year-old Greenland ice from St. John's, Newfoundland, Canada.
I'm curious as to why you did not mention the Maine Penny. As a potential pre-Colombian Norse artifact found in Maine, it seems that it would help improve your case that Leif Erickson did indeed head south to what is now the United States.
ReplyDeleteGood point, but we only have so much time in each show to investigate our case. There's a good chance the Norse penny will be discussed in a future episode.
ReplyDeleteAny further info on this would be awesome. I have not heard of this artifact.
DeleteErik
I felt this latest episode teased but didn't deliver. The Heavener Stone supposedly says something like Gnome or Grome Valley, but you never elaborated. Three other stones (two in photographs and Milwood), where shown but never translated, Nomans stone was never shown (at least on film). It would have really helped if you would have shown an expert(s) translating the runes on camera. Or are you claiming that these runes cannot be translated by anyone today? In that case, they could have been written by anyone and say anything. I don't see how that supports your Vikings-in-USA claim.
ReplyDeleteWe did say the most likely explanation for the Heavener Rune Stone is it is a land claim possibly left by a historical figure named Glome. The Noman's Land Island Rune Stone is only known through photographs of the inscription that appear in Annie Wood's 1931 book when the stone was on the beach at low tide. We also paraphrased the inscription as saying, "Leif Ericksson, 1001. There are two additional lines carved below that are not discernable in the photos. This is why the stone needs to come out of the water.
DeleteIn 2003, when I first visited the stone I could feel the carved grooves. On this latest trip it was underwater again and not able to be filmed. However, I was able to again feel the grooves, so maybe it can still be salvaged.
I don't believe the Millwood Rune Stone is of Viking age, I think it is of late medieval age. I wasn't the least bit surprised when the runic expert, whose identity I never learned, said they couldn't decipher it and just had to add the comment that "It was probably modern."
Just once, I'd like a scholar to simply say, "I don't know and it needs further study." The Millwood inscription, like the Kensington Rune Stone, is filled with dotted runes, symbols and codes. No wonder the scholars have no clue. These are unique documents that they should try to learn from, not try to find any way, and every way, to dismiss them.
You are correct the Millwood Rune Stone doesn't provide evidence to support Vikings in America. However, I am confident it will withstand objective scrutiny over time. Remember, we’re doing the best we can with what little known evidence that remains.
Thank you for your reply. Can you tell me who the expert was that looked at the Millwood stone (or the institution they worked for)? It's not that I don't believe you (I do) but I would like to ask them directly why they thought the inscription was modern. Also, can you shed any light on the other two stones that were shown in the photographs (or is that for a future episode :)?
DeleteThe production company found somebody to try and translate it, but never told me who it was. They did that on purpose and when whoever couldn't translate it, it was left at that. I have no interest in contacting them because there isn't a scholar in the world who will understand an inscription with this many dotted runes and "odd" characters. It fits no established runic tradition so they punt.
DeleteDuring my five years of working with both American and Scandinavian runologists and linguists I learned enough to become extremely dangerous. Many characters they insisted for over a century never existed showed up in early 2004 in the Larsson Papers, proving they didn't know as much as they thought. Of course, to cover themselves they claimed the Larsson Papers, which are clearly Masonic, proved that an immigrant could have brought them to Minnesota, blah, blah, blah...
the fact is if they existed in the 1880s then they existed before that, apparently several centuries before preserved within a secret society.
What I witnessed was an absolute refusal by scholars, at all costs, to even consider the possibility of a pre-Columbian origin. When you combine the contents within the inscription with the geological evidence that eliminates the possibility of a late 19th century origin you now are on the right track.
You must be talking about the other two inscriptions found near the Heavener Rune Stone, the Poteau and Shawnee Rune Stones. I have looked at these stones, but since they are carved into similar quartz-rich sandstone without a properly documented provenance there isn't much I can do. They contain similar runes at the Heavener and likely date to the same period if they are old.
Again, thank you for your response. It seems to be your position that we may not have enough examples of the ancient rune characters to completely or accurately translate them. I guess I assumed there are lots of examples of Scandinavian runic language examples that have been translated (which could be used as guides), even with their changes over time - but I am not a linguist or historian.
DeleteAlso, tTo my knowledge, we haven't found any Viking villages (similar to L’anse-aux-Meadows), or tools, cooking/eating utensils, ship-related artifacts, etc in the USA. It seems that many "stations" would have to be set up along the coasts and waterways to support the excursions deep into the continent (e.g. Minnesota and Oklahoma). Are you not concerned that there have been no other signs of prolonged Viking settlements in the USA?
The fact is we don't have any European examples of comparable runic inscriptions that correspond with the Kensington, Spirit Pond, Narragansett and Millwood Rune Stones. This should not be a surprise as the parties who carved them operated in extreme secrecy. However, there are certain runic, linguistic, dialect, and dating features that correspond nicely with known Scandinavian runic inscriptions of comparable dates. It’s the codes, symbols and allegories embedded within these inscriptions that understandably give the academics fits.
DeleteWe haven't found any Viking sites in what is now the United States, yet. Some may have been destroyed by development and some may still lie undiscovered. But as I said in an earlier post, a lack of evidence proves nothing.
With regard to the lack of medieval European sites I attribute to Cistercian/Templar parties traveling with the Natives, my question is: How would you know an otherwise typical Native campsite didn't have Europeans with them? What would you find to make that distinction? If they intermarried and assimilated, you wouldn't be able to tell the difference based on the artifacts found. That argument by Archaeologists is a red herring. I'd love it if they did find a sword, or a knife, or chainmail, or something definitive. One thing I know for sure is the Kensington inscription is old and therefore genuine. Maybe that evidence is still out there to be discovered in the future?
I think the Founding Fathers who were Freemasons wanted to believe
Deletetheir organization had evolved out of the Knights Templar and that there
was an "invisible college" lore that has a continuity since the 1300s.
Could there have been the equivalency of Renaissance tontines about
200 years earlier where the North Atlantic trade routes were a business
secret for the chosen few? Could you try getting 2 types of translations
consisting of one without the dots, dashes or accent marks and a 2nd
one with the modifiers? Even placing runes on the N.A. continent that
obey rules from a Scandinavian noble's code-book from the 30 Years'
War sets off quite a debate in and of itself! I am not an expert on the
early books printed up in Scandinavia that would have covered over
1500 years of a given nation's history, but an expert could say how
often an etching of an old object or inscription is inside an early book.
I see the dilemma. As someone who has European and Cherokee ancestors I can see that assimilation was a real possibility. However, do you think the Vikings would have gone completely "native"? I would assume that they would retain their superior metal tools/weapons. And, since we have found many Native American artifacts is odd that we have never found artifacts from other cultures mixed with them. My problem with this logic is that we could assume any foreign visitors were traveling with native tribes - Chinese, South America, African - why couldn't we make the same assumptions for them?
DeleteAlso, I've heard of some genetic research along these lines. Have there ever been any European genetic "markers" found among Native American DNA?
Again, thank you for all of your responses. I hope you and your family are enjoying the holidays.
Oral stories I've heard from Natives in Canada are that because the Vikings (circa 1000 A.D.) refused to intermarry and trade with local tribes, the Iroquois were brought in to wipe them out before getting a foothold. A century or so later when the Templars came, they knew better and adopted the local ways and were successful.
DeleteMany of those who intermarried likely did have "Norse" blood which should be traceable. Time will tell if any of these stories have a factual basis or not. I'm confident many of these questions will be answered, "In the blood."
Wow, I find that interesting, I was just telling my wife when the show started that I always believed the Iroquois may have received the idea of their long houses from the Viking long houses. I didn't know there was actual contact between them. I am sure others have thought of this, but I never heard anyone mention this. Has any expert compared the Viking long houses to the Iroquois long houses?
DeleteI believe research into Iroquois long houses has been done as has research on the unique style of dwellings the Mandan constructed. I am also convinced any pre-Columbian connections with Natives cultures here have been deliberately suppressed.
DeleteMaybe that will change in the near future?
OMG me & my sis luv u yo OMG! Hav fun on Rene's radio show 2nite XOXOXOXO
ReplyDeleteAlicia,
ReplyDeleteGlad you like the show and hope you enjoy the interview. Rene is a good friend and I'm looking forward to our chat.
Aquidneck island at low tide has an abundance of possible carvings of northern European origins. I. Have been searching the shoreline for years. If you don't look closely, you'll find nothing. It is there if you want to find it. Most locals don't give a hoot. People are afraid of the truth. In time, clarity will rise to the surface.
ReplyDeleteRobert,
DeleteThere are many inscriptions all along the northeast coast of the U.S. Most are Native petroglyphs, but many are likely from pre-Columbian visitors from across the Atlantic. You are also correct that progress isn't made by sitting behind a computer around complaining and criticizing. It requires action to get to the bottom of these mysteries.
Is it possible to see a photo of Nancy Millwood's stone that shows the inscription? Also a book that shows the inscriptions of the Oklahoma rune stones is "Oklahoma Treasures and treasures Tales" by Steve Wilson. (Pages 30 - 33)
ReplyDeleteImages of the Millwood Rune Stone belong to Nancy and her husband. Permission would have to come from them and I don't feel comfortable posting pictures on-line. However, I do have a picture of the inscription in my new book, “Akhenaten to the Founding Fathers: The Mysteries of the Hooked X.”
DeleteYou can also see the Oklahoma inscriptions in Gloria Farley's 1994 book, "In Plain Sight: Old World Records in Ancient America" (Pages 230-240).
I did get a copy of your book and am reading it. It is very interesting so far. As your live in Minnesota, have you looked in the stories of the Norway Lake rune stone?
DeleteI have studied the Norway Lake Rune Stone and it is not old. It was carved in the mid 20th Century IMHO
DeleteI really enjoy your show. Thank-you for covering such a wide range of topics.
DeleteIn the book "In Plain Site" on pages 228 - 230, the author refers to the idea of a cave being located near the Heavener Rune Stone. Have you considered looking in that possibility? Would the use of ground penetrating radar determine if this is a topic to pursue?
It seems that with the number of rune stones found in the Eastern Oklahoma area, there may be more objects that haven't been found.
I was disappointed to not hear in the episode what the translation was for Nancy's runestone, if there was one. And if not, why not? So what if it's inconclusive? Shouldn't it be significant and to what? That wasn't covered in the episode.
DeleteHi Scott..Love your show. I just emailed you about some evidence you might be interested in. I am located in Clayton New York on the St. Lawrence River where there has always been stories by the natives of Vikings coming here.
ReplyDeleteI will look for your email and follow up if I can. You are quite right about Native oral stories about pre-Columbian visitors to North America. I have heard many stories myself from tribal elders of many tribes.
DeleteCan they all be wrong?
Talk to George Tucker OakBluffsMass MVI. Him/my father found a viking sword under a rock while building addition in Chilmark 70s.,sent it to Smithsonian. They confirmed.
DeleteI guess I'm confused. You make the following claim: "Nancy Millwood's stone is almost certainly genuine, but I don't think it's Viking in age. I suspect it's more likely medieval, probably carved sometime between 1200-1500 A.D.". Then you support this "1200-1500 A.D." estimate with the following: "I was told that whoever tried to translate it (I still do not know who it was) eventually punted and said, "...it was probably modern.""
ReplyDeleteIf is was probably modern, then what evidence do you have to support a claim of 1200-1500 A.D.?
It was inappropriate for whoever looked at the inscription and couldn't translate it to have made any comment at all. Professionals shouldn't render ANY opinion unless they have factual support. Clearly they didn't know what they were looking at, but as has happened so often in the past, this person felt compelled to tell us what they 'think' regardless of the implications. This is one of the reasons why we have so many misunderstandings about our past. Just once, I'd like to hear a scholar say, "I don't know."
DeleteSome aspects of the inscription that indicate 1200-1500 A.D. time period are various symbols, dotted runes, and layout that are reminiscent of the Kensington and Spirit Pond Rune Stones which date to this same period.
By the way, why can't you tell us your name?
Scott,
DeleteIt is possible that, in the future, some runologist will be able to translate the Millwood Stone. However, until that occurs, you have to accept the fact that the only competent runologist to make that attempt was unable to make any sense of it. Therefore, there is, at present, no basis for concluding that the symbols on it are genuine runes.
I can think of two alternative possibilities worth considering: (1) that it is a clumsy (or at least unserious) attempt to replicate runes, presumably as some kind of hoax or (2) the symbols only look superficially like runes, but are actually nothing of the kind, in which case they may be American Indian pictographs. If possibility (2) is not plausible, then we are left with possibility (1), which implies that it is, indeed, almost certainly probable. In either case, I do not think you have any basis, so far, for saying anything other than "I don't know," yourself.
FYI, I am a different "Anonymous" than any of the ones who previously posted here.
I do have a basis to render an opinion as I've already stated. For example, the dotted Runes follow a pattern similar to what I've seen before. These characters look nothing like any Native carvings I have ever seen and clearly contain many know Scandinavian and Anglo-Saxon type runes.
DeleteIt could be an unserious attempt at an inscription, but I doubt it. There are other things I've noticed, but in the interest of not revealing what might be in a future episode, I'm going to hold off on that.
I'm more than happy to say I don't know when that is the case. However, in this case I feel I have enough evidence to say the Millwood inscription is more likely old then not old. The difficulty is many medieval inscriptions were secret messages meant to be read by only those who understood the unique characters. That appears to be the case here. I know of no runologists in history who understood this point. They all tried to make unusual inscriptions like this "fit" into their box of knowledge instead of letting the inscriptions tell them what it was. That is the essence of Scientific Method.
Hi Scott,
ReplyDeleteI just finished watching your Viking episode. I am skeptical, to say the least, of the truth of some of the claims that your show puts forward, but I will leave that aside.
My issue is with the IMPORTANCE of the potential discoveries you hope to make. The Viking episode is a good example. You say that if evidence of Viking incursions to Martha's Vineyard, New England, etc. could be proven, these new facts would "change American history." Would they really? We already know that Vikings were in Eastern Canada, so it seems quite possible, even likely, that they visited the eastern coast of what is today the United States. However, it seems to me that proof of such a visit would do nothing to change our understanding of the political or cultural history of the United States. Did the discovery at L'Anse aux Meadows forever change Canadian history? I doubt it. What difference does it really make whether or not the Viking that we know to have visited Newfoundland crossed a political boundary that would not exist until 700 years in the future?
Again, leaving aside the veracity of your claims, I just don't see their great importance even if they were verifiable. Would it be an amazing revelation if medieval Welsh, ancient Egyptians, or the "Lost Tribe of Israel" visited North America? Of course, it would be. But it would do nothing to change our understanding of the course and meaning of our shared American history and heritage.
Ben,
DeleteYou are welcome to be as skeptical as you want. However, I couldn't disagree more on the importance of the truth about the history of our country. There are many individuals along with most local, state and federal governments who take great pride and interest in historical events that in some cases seem pretty minor IMHO.
However, with respect to the many pre-Columbian cultures that visited North America, there are political and religious implications that would not only change history of the past, but in the future as well. I'm not going to discuss details here; you can watch the show to get the information. What does matter is doing everything we can to get the story right. There may be other implications we don’t even know of that become vitally important once we know what really happened.
You may not think the truth about our history matters, but there are millions of people in this country who do.
Scott,
DeleteYou are right that minor historical events are honored on a local and regional level. Local history is important.
You seem to be saying that we should seek information for its own sake, because we may not know the importance what we do not know. I couldn't agree more. This is the essence of academic inquiry.
I have, in fact, watched most episodes of AE. I can't quote extensively from specific episodes, but the bulk of your work can be easily summarized.
"Ancient and pre-modern people from Europe and the greater Mediterranean world had been visiting North America for hundreds and possibly thousands of years before Columbus. Their motivations were often escape from European turmoils or to safe-keep sacred objects or vast treasure. These voyages were either never recorded, have been lost to history, or have been suppressed by mainstream academics and/or powerful elites/governments."
That feels like an honest summary of your arguments.
I fail to see where these pre-Columbian incursions into North America intersect with the consensus history of North American and the United States in a way that would alter our understanding. There is a reason why the voyage of Columbus is discussed with more historical import than the Viking presence in Newfoundland, and it has nothing to do with academic inertia or the controlling influence of elites. It is because the Columbus expedition sparked European colonization and occupation of the Americas while the Viking presence did not.
I would get your point if, say, the Minoans had established a lasting presence in the upper Great Lakes or the presence of the Ark of the Covenant in the United States influenced Thomas Jefferson (or something). But I don't see where in our history any of the events that you allude to and seek proof of actually CHANGED history.
Again, you are right that we should seek to understand our universe, our plant, and ourselves without requiring that any great benefit or understanding be the likely outcome. But in that same humble spirit, we should not conflate what is unknown with what is revelatory.
I'm a little surprised at your response Ben. How do you know if there was significant impact if you don't know who was here? Is it possible the Founding Fathers were influenced by the medieval Cistercians and Knights Templar that resulted in the eventual structure and strategies of our government, the free enterprise system, and the military? Another question is did the medieval visitors learn about North America from the Viking explorers? These are interesting questions we can't begin to answer unless we know the true history of our country.
DeleteCome on man!
SCOTT,
ReplyDeleteBig fan of the show!! I saw the Kensington stone when I was 16 - 64 now. I've been interested in it ever since- glad that you and Committee Films took up the quest. If someone were to find another Kensington type stone and the inscriptions were traced to a pre-Columbian people or country - wouldn't that be considered an early land claim by those people ( or their country of origin )- wouldn't that open a can of worms in the World Court?
Pasadena-- p@
Pasadena,
DeleteI'm convinced there is at least one more rune stone out there somewhere. The KRS was intentionally broken off from a larger slab of rock, where is the rest of it? It's very possible there are multiple land claim runic inscriptions yet to be found, and yes, it would make the skeptics even more frustrated than they already are.
Mr. Wolter
ReplyDeleteWhy is it that academics should say "I don't know and it needs further study" without adding "its probably ________" but you are able to say you "suspect" all three are genuine without knowing what the stone or the runologist said?
It seems like both of you should be able to add a professional opinion- or that neither of you should.
Brent,
ReplyDeleteI'm a little confused by your question, but let me try to clarify my statement. The geological, contextual, historical, runological, linguistic, and grammar evidence are consistent with the Kensington Rune Stone being authentic. The Heavener Rune Stone exhibits extensive weathering, the land claim context make sense, and there no factual evidence that it is consistent with it not being authentic.
The scholar who doesn’t "believe" the Millwood Rune Stone is modern has no evidence to support their claim. Because I see similar features on the Millwood Stone, such as various dotted runes and similar symbols, I suspect it is likely authentic as well. However, more research by competent experts is certainly needed. Competent experts doesn't necessarily mean academics.
My comments were partly driven by this expert not being able to simply admit they couldn't make heads or tails of it. They had to tell us what they "think." Scholars did the same with the KRS and that is one of the reasons why it languished so long. It turns out they were wrong about the KRS and this person is probably wrong about the Millwood inscription.
Scott,
DeleteIt is possible that, in the future, some competent runologist will be able to translate the Millwood Stone. Until that happens, though, there is no factual basis for concluding that it is a genuine rune stone.
I can think of two other possibilities worth considering: (1) it is a clumsy (or at least unserious) attempt to replicate runes, presumably as some kind of hoax, in which case it is almost certainly modern; or (2) it is a set of other types of symbols that only superficially resemble runes, perhaps American Indian pictographs.
In either case, there is, as of yet, I do not know how you can fairly say anything except "I don't know," either.
Harry,
DeleteSorry for the late response. I disagree it's a clumsy hoax primarily because of the various and pervasive dotted runes, but I also see things I haven't discussed that might show up in a future episode. I know that’s easy for me to say, but it happens to be true and leads me to believe it is more than likely medieval in origin. Stay tuned…
Scott-- did either the Heavener or Millwood stones have any " Mooring Stone" -"Holed Boulders" around their sites- like the KRS site? That would defiantly bolster their Authenticity>
ReplyDeleteI have heard about stone holes (I don't use the term "mooring stones" as it implies an interpretation that in most cases is impossible) near the Heavener Rune Stone, but I have not seen them personally.
ReplyDeleteI have not been to the Millwood Rune Stone discovery site so I can't speak to whether they are there or not. I'm hoping to visit the site in the near future.
Scott, I didn't know about your show, America Unearthed, until a couple of weeks ago when my wife became bored and looked for something else to watch. I immediately recognized that you may be the individual instrumental in putting together the information on the Kensington Rune Stone and the connection with the Knights Templar. I've become a fan of your show ever since. I remember reading books about possible Norse exploration of North America when I was in high school. As I was doing website research on this subject, I found some mention about runic writing located on Lake Winnipeg. I did a web search typing in Lake Winnipeg Rune 1362 and an old Canadian news article popped up about runic writing and that date. I'm sure you are familiar with that article but if not, look it up. Bruce
ReplyDeleteHi Bruce,
DeleteI have heard rumors about a runic inscription in the Lake WInnepeg area in the past, but nothing soild I could follow up on. If anyones does have information I'd love to hear about it.
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
ReplyDeleteThe rune stone was found near Saluda, North Carolina. I haven't had a chance to visit the site, but Nancy said she will take me there.
ReplyDeleteScott,
ReplyDeleteI believe that in the 1st century AD, as Jews came to believe in Jesus (Yeshua) as Messiah and underwent persecution, they are the ones who came to America and the Los Luna Decalogue stone is from their writings as well as other artifacts in America.
Carole
Carole,
ReplyDeleteYou might just be right; the Dragon-fly style Cross of Lorraine (if that's what it is) would be consistent with the First Century and not the Lost Tribes period.
Hello Scott... I am a huge fan of your show!!! I look forward to it every Saturday. I work out of Heavener, Oklahoma and live in Poteau, Oklahoma. I'm just curious if you visited Spiro Mounds while you were in the area? It is 30 miles North of the Heavener Rune Stone next to the Arkansas River. The date you placed on the Heavener Rune Stone is around the time Spiro Mounds area was active. If so, you put Europeans in the same area with the Caddo Americans at the same time. The Caddo leaders at Spiro controlled a large portion of the mid-south and artifacts from natives living in the North and West have been found there. I think it would be worth a look to see if you can find any European artifacts or other evidence of European presence at Spiro.
ReplyDeleteAlso, in relation to the KGC episode, the area to the south of Heavener in the Ouachita Mountains is supposed to have plenty of KGC caches. All I've heard are stories.
Please let me know if you make it back to the Poteau, Oklahoma, Fort Smith, Arkansas area. I'll be more than happy to show you around, along with some good food. Thanks...
I have heard of the Spiro Mounds, but not seen them yet. Even though we did feature the Heavener Rune Stone in this episode, there is more work to done in your area.
ReplyDeleteI greatly appreciate your kind offer and hopefully, we'll get another chance to snoop around down there.
Thanks Scott... Its nice to hear from you... Please look me up if/when you come back to this area. I'll be happy to show you around, introduce you to some knowledgeable people, and show you some hospitality. My name is Jeff Conaway (like the dead actor). My email is or you can call/text me at 479-719-2946. Hope you get to come back soon. Thanks!!! - Jeff
DeleteScott Your shows have gotten worse instead of better, the episode on the underwater pyramids was just a plain joke. I cannot believe you would even put garbage like that out there. This 2nd season has been a huge waste of time, you don't prove anything and don't even come close to proving anything. Just hair brained stories with nothing to back them up.
ReplyDeleteAnonymous,
ReplyDeleteWhile I agree the underwater pyramids part of that episode wasn't the best, learning about nearby Aztalan from the former Wisconsin State Archaeologist, Bob Birmingham, was great. I completely disagree that season 2 isn't better, I think the episodes are better overall than season 1. Among other things we proved was the Rock Wall was natural, the Bat Creek Stone is genuine, and that the Clovis theory is dead. Pretty damn good stuff so far if you ask me.
My advice to you is stop wasting yours and my time by posting nonsense. Don't watch the show if it pains you that much. If you and all the other complainers are going to post criticism, have the guts to use your real name and please get your facts right.
Scott-
ReplyDeleteThe Du Luth Stone- ( see page 72 of Akhenaten to the founding Fathers ) had a date of 1679 and was found out in middle of no- where in Minnesota, so was the KRS. Is it possible that the 1362 people put a stone in the same spot - because it was an important spot ( as Land Claim ) to the 1362 people but also to Du Luth ( as a Land Claim )? Du Luth heard about the stone with rune writing on it and replaced it with his own stone ( The De Luth Stone ) thus negating any land claim made by anyone other than the French? Talk about a conspiracy!- one thing we do know, Du Luth didn't work for the Smithsonian!!! p@
Pasadena,
DeleteActually, your idea of newer French land claims inserted to replace older ones is exactly what I think Du Luth and Pierre La Verendrye were doing! Stay tuned, you might see more on this subject matter in a future episode.
Hi Scott hope to be finding you well, don't let the nay-saying Trolls get you down. You are so close to finding what you seek. I have some pics. of sites you will want to take a look at. Having trouble with History channel web site where do you send info. thanks David
ReplyDeleteDavid,
ReplyDeleteThe Trolls only inspire me; we've got them cornered and they know it. They can't refute us with evidence so they whine, criticise, and call us names.
Try sending pictures to america.unearthed@gmail.com
My Grandmother grew up in Heavener Ok, and told us she used to swim in the creek where the rune stone is. She told us the stone with the writing used to be way up on the side of the mountain way over her head. It supposedly broke off and slid down the mountain to where it is now. I have large fossilized nautilus snails that where found on family land further south, in Hugo area. Maybe just maybe there was a lot more water around when they were here.
ReplyDeleteI really liked this episode. Are these still ongoing?
ReplyDeleteI was disappointed to not hear in the episode (I forget which one) what the translation was for Nancy's runestone, if there was one. And if not, why not? So what if it's inconclusive? Shouldn't it be significant and to what? That wasn't covered in the episode.
ReplyDeleteWe are currently filming Season 3 right now. It'll probably air starting in September or October.
ReplyDeleteMy aunt lives in the Crowsnest Pass, Canada and there is a legend that the Lost Lemon gold mine was located in the area. Possibly on Turtle Mountain where the Frank slide happened. The last time I went to visit my aunt she showed me these almost perfectly round (spheres) rocks of various sizes. The bigger they are the heavier they are. Seems like they shouldn't be that heavy for the bigger sizes. I got to see one that had broken into 2 and the inside seemed to have layers to it. Only my aunt knows where to find these strange rocks and would like to find out what they are. Would be willing to send some to be studied if you are interested.
ReplyDeleteCynthia,
ReplyDeleteSorry for the delay; if you want to send pictures I'd be happy to start with that. If you have pictures of the inside surfaces of the broken one that would be helpful too.
Send them to: swolter@amengtest.com
Thanks!
Scott, I saw this news story today, on the same subject...thought you would be interested. http://worldnewsdailyreport.com/usa-viking-artefacts-discovered-near-great-lakes/
ReplyDeleteScott, I saw this news story today, on this same subject and thought you would be interested. http://worldnewsdailyreport.com/usa-viking-artefacts-discovered-near-great-lakes/
ReplyDeleteLeeAnn,
DeleteSeveral people have forwarded this article and upon reading it I was struck by how it seems too good to be true; especially for my pre-Columbian Templars-Cistercians in America research. I'm going to wait and see how this vets out before I get excited.
Thanks for thinking of me.
Hi in this feature you showed a women I was watching on TV today had a crossing M sign on her stone she found as a kid and you where going to have someone read the stone. Was it read and what did it say. thank you
ReplyDeleteRichard,
ReplyDeleteUnfortunately, we don't have a translation of the inscription yet. It hasn’t' been studied by a competent runologist yet. However, if the inscription was carved by who I think made it, the scholars won't be able to decipher it anyway and will likely punt (of claim it's a hoax when they can't figure it out).
This inscription contains characters that I've never seen before and is a real mystery.
Ancient American has some great articles. Wish Scott if you read this would check into some things they have featured like the Giants of eight foot plus on display at the museum in Lima, Peru and the supposed bodies encased in beeswax in a cave near Ladysmith, Wisconsin.
ReplyDeleteSuppose you know about the stone with carvings found in Blaine, Minnesota..
ReplyDeleteI have every issue of Ancient American magazine and have had several articles published there. The "Giant" is big and I'd like to more in that vein.
ReplyDeleteThanks!
Hi Scott,hope to be finding you well. Was watching your show on the Holy Grail,and noticed that you seem to be having a hard time deciphering some of the Runes you find. Perhaps I can be of assistance. Each Rune is not only a letter- they are complex symbols that have there own colors,numbers,1/2 month of the year ect. The hooked X for example is GEBO. This is the exchange of gifts between the human and the divine. The hook or thorn is always the symbol of the Christ. A circle with a dot in the center is the symbol for the Sun but it is also used as the symbol for Gold. The ancient legend is that a 1/3 of the temple treasure was to be placed in areas or gates. To be stored for the Saints during the end times. Are you one of the Saints? Ho Ho Ho Merry Christmas to all David
ReplyDeleteDavid,
ReplyDeleteI am aware of the complexity of runes and multiple meanings for the various symbols/characters. I'm also aware how rune alphabets (Futhork) have evolved over time. Getting to the bottom of a runic inscription is a lot more complicated than people realizes. Nowhere is this more true than the Kensington Rune Stone.
Anyway, you'll see more information presented about the Hooked X in upcoming episodes. It should be fun!
Happy Holidays to you and yours.
Scott,
ReplyDeleteI have been fascinated with Viking stories in Rhode Island ever since I first saw the Newport Tower as a child in the 70s.
I was very glad to read last night that the Narragansett Stone is now safe; I had seen the rerun episode recently of your show in which it had been stolen.
After reading about the Stone, I got curious for more information, so I started researching Narragansett Bay. Surfing online I came across a 1527 map by Maggiolo that lists a "norman villa" at the site of Narragansett Bay, as well as a "longa ville" south around Delaware.
It seems some scholars interpret this as Italianized-french, as in Normanville or Longeville, but Maggiolo, and Verrazzano, who did the actual exploration in 1524, were from Florence. They were Italian. In Italian, those phrases would have meant Norman villa or Long villa.
The Lenape Indians built long houses along Delaware Bay, and the Norse built long houses as well, as you know. Why can't longa house mean long house?
Maggiolo writes "refugio" to mean "refuge", as Verrazzano describes the area around Narragansett... if that is literal, why isn't "norman villa"?
What's also interesting is that I read part of a book by Ken Brown in which he provides Verrazzano's account of Narragansett Bay... Verrazzano describes the Narragansett natives as being tall and fair-skinned, some tending towards white.
Brown also shows a 1643 narrative by Roger Williams who states the Narragansett Indians were from Iceland.
Interestingly, recent DNA research in Iceland has found 80 Icelanders with markers linked to Native Americans, and/or Asians, but not Inuit. Researchers feel that most likely they are descended from a Native American woman and an Icelandic male circa 1000 AD.
It seems to be that there is compelling evidence, hundreds of years old, as well as DNA evidence, to suggest that the Narragansett Bay has Norse history, and that the Norse or their native Indian descendants could have carved the Rune Stone.
I sent you an email to america.unearthed@gmail.com with a more detailed explanation, and links to articles, books, and photos.
If you find it worthy, I hope you follow this thread and see if it leads to something. Perhaps there are remnants of a Norse civilization around the Narragansett area, or perhaps some of the Narragansett tribe still carries Icelandic dna, if the original tribe survived the diseases that wiped out so many natives.
Best wishes...
Aaron,
ReplyDeleteI have seen most of the information that you posted, but there were a couple nice new tidbits; thanks. have you heard about the supposed skeleton with red hair in armor found at Fort Ninigret?
No, I have not, I will look that up, thanks!
ReplyDeleteNot sure if you read my email, but I mentioned seeing old carvings along the rocks below the cliffwalk at Newport Beach as a kid. The ones I recall dated to the 1700s, with actual dates, but I was not allowed to climb out very far...
Has anyone found any older carvings along those rocks, perhaps further out? If you know someone in Newport, it might be worth asking. I don't think it's worth you making a special trip, I just wonder in light of all the runes in New England, if there are carvings older than the 18th century out there to be found.
Oh... have you researched Dighton Rock in Berkeley, MA? No one seems to know what those markings are on that boulder.
ReplyDeleteAaron,
ReplyDeleteYes, I have looked at Dighton Rock very carefully and unfortunately, it's tough to do much with. It's a relatively soft, poorly cemented sandstone and the carvings are badly weathered. There could very well be pre-Columbian inscriptions there, but it's hard to see any of them clearly anymore.
There is a cool video I came across today by the National Film Board of Canada - Viking Visitors to North America. It was produced in 1979, apparently for use in schools. If you haven't seen it, it's worth watching...
ReplyDeleteIt seems there are many researchers finding artifacts and other evidence (written, dna, etc.) to demonstrate that the Vikings/Norse were all over America.
If there is not already a united effort to hold an annual conference, where researchers can meet and share in their efforts, and lend credibility to the Norse history in America, then I suggest one be formed. It seems there are many authors, researchers, archeologists, who could participate.
I had another thought today, that America Unearthed could file freedom of information act requests from the Smithsonian, to uncover what has gone on behind the scenes, regarding suppressed discoveries, discussions, artifacts, etc..
I also would bet that you could find a congressman or senator with an open-minded interest in US History... perhaps he/she could request an investigation into the missing artifacts from the Smithsonian... those widely reported to have been donated, only to be "lost" now.
One question, someone anonymous posted above the suggestion that you contact:
"George Tucker OakBluffsMass MVI. Him/my father found a viking sword under a rock while building addition in Chilmark 70s.,sent it to Smithsonian. They confirmed."
Did you ever contact him and learn anything about this sword?
Sir, my name is James. I have a question for you and hopfully you can answer it. What is your veiw on free masonry. I have the opportunity to become one. Recently I had a conversation with a very die hard Catholic. We got on the topic of free masonry. We said all they were was atheists and a cult. They do not believe in jesus or god. They also learn and do there teachings from king james version.
ReplyDeleteJames,
ReplyDeleteI can't speak to the King James Bible point, but my view on Freemasonry is very positive. It most certainly is not comprised of "atheists and a cult." That is Church propaganda they preach to the faithful; it's total BS. In fact, they want are new members to make a statement about a belief in a higher power. They don't care what religion you are or if you don't practice any religion. They just want you to express a belief in a higher power, whatever that deity may be including Jesus and/or God. It's up to you.
They strongly encourage tolerance and when in Lodge there are only two subjects that brothers are prohibited from discussed in open lodge; politics and religion. My personal view after studying the Craft for several years is their priorities are very sound, family first, country second, religion third.
I can also say I would highly recommend Freemasonry to anyone with an open and inquisitive mind.
Good luck!
Scott
ReplyDelete,
Would you be interested in a mott and bailey style hill (manmade and pre-Columbian), within easy reach of the great lakes system, out of the traditional range of the mound builders culture? Check out Fort Hill Cemerery in Auburn NY.
There is so much to investigate I'm going to need a couple more lifetimes. It's all so fascinating and fun.
ReplyDeleteScott,
ReplyDeleteWe obviously need the solid evidence to officially rewrite the history of the United States or at any rate it's "pre history", but the known evidence, along with your programs and intellectual deductions clearly point to where that history is going to eventually land. Intuition is no match for science but the science and logic you have applied makes the intuition much more than that.
It's amazing that the Noman's Island Stone has not been preserved. Its more than skepticism at play, it's clearly resistance. Some, for their own particular reasons, don't want that history rewritten. Some have posted statements here that are incredulous, but when you get "experts" in the field nevertheless commenting upon runes they can't translate it's less surprising that far less academic people make comments here that don't stand logical scrutiny.
Keep up the good work. Let the truth be revealed.
martin meyer
Scott,
ReplyDeleteHave you been to the Laval Circle and Laval Stones in St. Francois, Laval, Quebec?
https://lavalhallalujah.wordpress.com/7460-boul-des-mille-iles-laval-quebec/
P@
Pasadena,
DeleteI have not, but it looks interesting? Another site to add to the list!
Hi Scott,
ReplyDeleteI thought you and/or your readers might like to know about DNA, Artifact and other research to be presented on the Viking/Norse and American Indian connection...
The Viking Club, Lenape Indian organizations, and the Scandinavian organizations in St. Louis, are hosting a joint symposium at the Missouri History Museum on 26-27 September to discuss the merging of the Viking / Norse and American Indian Cultural Integration for several hundred years.
See more info at link below:
https://www.academia.edu/11774533/Viking_Norse_and_American_Indian_Cultural_Integration_1000_-_1500_A.D
Aaron,
ReplyDeleteThat sounds like a conference I'd like to attend! Thanks for sharing the link.
I have information that might explain the reason the Anasazi left Choco canyon but my computer wont let me use the link provided on the h2 web page. Walter
ReplyDeleteWalter,
ReplyDeleteYou are welcome to share anything you'd like here that you are comfortable with.
I always enjoy your show, but I am especially interested in the Vikings for the DNA connection. I have an ancestor who is said to have been a Cherokee, but I think she was more likely Lenape. We have determined that her mitochondrial DNA was H1c2, which seems to be concentrated in Sweden. Maybe she was Swedish, but maybe the Lenape mixed with the New Sweden Colony or Vikings. I hope you eventually prove the Vikings were in the US. I think they were.
ReplyDeleteHi James,
DeleteNew discoveries are happening daily in the arena of early Norse explorations and they are inching closer to the U.S. I'm 100% confident they came to our shores over a millennia ago. I'm also confident confirmation of it will happen in our lifetimes.
Stay tuned!
Hello Scott, my name is Brandon Jordan. I live in Mai e and grew up here. I first heard of the viking penny when I was a child, I'm now 30 years old and have told my children about the penny as my father did me. I full heartedly believe the Vikings no doubt came to north america maine in particular we share so much with nova scotia. I feel as though you should dig into it more I'm a huge fan of your work and if anybody can prove they visited north america I feel 9t is you. I would be more then welcome to help you out if you ever came to check it out. Brandon Jordan
ReplyDelete