Saturday, February 14, 2015

St. Clair Sinclair DNA and the Templars

My friend, Steve St. Clair, was very excited about showing me Saint Martin des Champs in Paris. He, Alan Butler, Janet and I had many talks about why this was so important to him. In fact, he had a Power Point show with him when we met up at Troyes to educate us about why we had to include St Martin des Champs in the episode. So we did.

The connections Steve found at Saint Martin des Champs prove without any doubt that the Sinclair / St. Clair family of Herdmanston were closely connected to, and in several cases, directly descended from important Templar families.

Today, I’d like turn this space over to guest blogger Steve to explain his research. _________________________________________________

Saint Martin des Champs, Paris

Merovingian burial, Saint Martin des Chanps

The chequy armorial at Tomar Portugal, 
reminiscent of Warenne or Vaux of county Norfolk, England.

We saw several other sites besides the ones you saw on the season finale.
This is a painting at Saint-Sulpice, Paris.

First, thanks Scott for the opportunity to be a guest blogger here. Looking at the pics you’ve put up of our trip to France, I have to wonder why we didn’t include our wives in the season finale. The episodes would have been much better looking! Anita and I had great trip and a lot of fun hanging out with you, Janet, Alan Butler, and of course Maria & Andy and the wonderful crew from Committee Films.

I remember the night in the hotel’s small bar when we were all quite tired - none more than Alan who had flown over that day and had quite a drive to meet us. I pulled out my computer to show you guys a presentation about what I was finding regarding the priory of Saint Martin des Champs. Near the end, I mentioned that my greatest interest was the Counts of Champagne because it was becoming clear to me that they were connected to the Saint-Clair family. Alan, tired as he was, lit up, “The Counts of Champagne were the money behind the Templars!”

Over the course of the next couple days, Alan wasn’t feeling very well (the weather was pretty miserable), so I drove his rental car with him in the passenger seat. We had a lot of time to chat in-depth about the importance of the Counts of Champagne, the Champagne Fairs, and much more. It has been collaborations like these over the past many years that has made my own research into the DNA and history of the Saint-Clair family much more accurate, interesting, and engaging.

Many of the angry skeptics, who take pot shots at the show from the peanut gallery, don’t seem to realize how such shows are made. After commercials, each episode of America Unearthed is 44 minutes. That doesn’t leave a ton of time to go into extreme detail about the research being shown. An example is my work on Saint Martin des Champs. It took me 16 months to research and write the 6,000 word paper now on my Sinclair DNA website at this link –

That recent website post at St Clair Sinclair DNA Research is generating quite a bit of interest, both from those who welcome it, and those who are upset by my claims.

The facts are the facts. At some point, the pundits must come out with legitimate evidence to dispute my claims, or slink away with their tails between their legs. The beauty of DNA is that it doesn’t lie. People who have something to gain can attempt to bend the truth, but the data itself is brutally visible.

I’ve seen several people in our own DNA study attempt to use their results to make terribly weak claims. Yet the science of DNA always wins out, much like Scott’s research into artifacts like the Kensington Runestone and the Tucson Lead Artifacts.

Stones and DNA are both factual, scientific evidence. As Scott said in part 1 of the season finale, the fakes reveal themselves quickly, but the legitimate ones just won’t go away.

In this blog post, I want to talk about the evidence that just won’t go away in the St Clair Sinclair DNA study

Several years ago after extensive reading of medieval benefaction records to priories and abbeys, I realized that the medievalists I most admired were skirting around something. They seemed to be heavily focused on medieval people with different surnames who were donating land and money to the same abbeys. But they seemed reluctant to make too many definitive claims.

For instance, a particular abbey called Savigny in France. It was one of only a couple abbeys I have found to which the St. Clairs directly donated lands. Yet, notice the other families also donating land there:
  • Vilers (a brother of Norman St. Clairs.) 
  • Montfort (tenant and likely related to St. Clairs.) 
  • Creon (Templar family.)
  • Meulan (major land holder and likely related to St. Clair.) 
  • D’Albini (descendants of the Honour of Belvoir and to which the St. Clairs married into. Directly related to the Counts of Champagne.) 
  • Mandeville (Geoffrey de Mandeville, made a Knight Templar on his deathbed and founder of the Temple Church in London, the single most important Templar building in England.) 
  • Vaux (married into the d’Albini family. I’m directly related to the de Vaux) 
  • Bisset (witnessed the grant of land to the Sinclairs of Rosslyn and showing up in the DNA SNP matches of our Exeter Lineage.)

The clues above are why I’m so obsessed by these names. But not just because of their benefaction to abbeys and priories.

People changed their names at the drop of a hat in medieval times – move to new land, take your second name from that new land. Eventually these names stuck.

The names changed, but the DNA did not

Richard de Vilers was a brother of Haimo and William de St. Clair in about the year 1120. Those brothers gave the land of Richard de Vilers to Savigny, with the permission of Stephen count of Mortain. (Savigny was an unusually important Cistercian Abbey in the diocese of Avranches, France.) Hubert of Saint-Clair was a tenant of the count of Mortain in Somerset.
They were all related. Their surnames were not yet fixed.
So now, if you were to find two people alive today with the same DNA, yet one’s name is Vilers, and the other is St. Clair…guess what…they both descend from the same medieval family.

Finding people closely allied in medieval records
Finding two people alive today with those same two surnames
who match closely in DNA SNPs
Both are descendants of the medieval people.

This is precisely what I’ve found

But these weren’t just any connections. The Saint-Clairs of Herdmanston have connections to those at the very top of the founding of the Order of the Temple.

And it became very clear by doing detailed research into which families were giving gifts to the priory of Saint Martin des Champs in Paris. But that’s only one religious house. There are many others that I’m digging into.

We’re not just talking about DNA SNP matches:
  1. Particular families alive today are in the DNA SNP matches of the Herdmanston family. That’s SNP matches. They share paternal blood with particular families. It is irrefutable. 
  2. Those particular families fit the narrative of the Saint-Clair family. What do I mean by that? I mean if you go back and study the actual records of the Saint-Clair family, then you will understand that you must show some of these same particular families in your DNA SNP matches to make any claim of connecting to the narrative of that particular Saint-Clair family story. 
  3. The particular families who fit into the narrative of our Saint-Clair family story in medieval records of land, benefaction, and/or marriage? 
  • Mandeville
  • Wishart
  • Strathern
  • Bisset
  • Moreville
  • Redver
  • Viller
  • Warenne 
  • Vaux
  • Ashley
  • Urtaico
  • Mortimer 
  • Etc.
As Scott said about particular ancient carvings, they keep hanging around impossible to disprove. DNA SNPs combined with medieval document connections are very much like that.

Scott, Janet, and Alan, I’m delighted we got to chase the Templars through France. And I think we’re just getting started.

Steve St. Clair


  1. Mr. Scott,

    I have been watching your program on Netflix and I noticed something in the Shugborough Shepherd's Monument, you discuss the Hook X, and I think there might be a hidden Hook X in the monument.

    In the painting you don't see it, but in the reversed monument you can make it out.

    There are two staffs that come together inbetween the two shepherds and then make a V. If you notice the shepherd on the left, with his hand/arm posistion and clothing hanging down and the position of the staff, you will see the "Hook" or where the hook would be on a Hooked X.

    In the original pairing you do not see this, since in that one, the one on the left his staff is straight, whereas, the one on the right leans away from it. But on the mirrored side of it, the staff positions make a V shape, and it does appear that the hook is where it should be.

    I noticed that, and thought I would pass it on.

    1. Steve, Scott, and reader's of this blog,

      Any idea what the "box" is, or represents in the Shugborough version of "The Shepherds of Arcadia? I ask because, using a mirror, the Mona Lisa appears to hold this "box" in her hands.


      Is the "Warenne" anyway related to "Warren"?

      Best regards,


      BTW- I wish there had been more attention paid to the checkered outdoor pavement Scott and Steve walked over in the finale. Another Secret in plain sight.

    2. Hi Anthony,
      Scott will have to answer the Shugborough question.
      As to the Warenne / Warren family, they are definitely the same.

      Back in December, I went over to the land of William de Warenne, builder of Castle Acre. What an amazing place. Chequy pattern all over the place. Maybe you noticed it on one of the towers where we entered the grounds of the Commanderie d’Arville? Not sure why that’s there. Such decisions were not often random.

      I’ll be posting a video of that trip soon.

      Did you see the link above? If you scroll down, you’ll see the shields of the Warennes. I didn’t dwell on all those families, but several are very interesting - especially the Dreux. There is a poorly documented genealogy that attempts to connect the Dreux to the Sinclairs of Rosslyn. I haven’t studied it enough, but a researcher on our family for whom I have the greatest respect tells me it’s a fiction.


    3. I stated:"There are two staffs that come together inbetween the two shepherds and then make a V. If you notice the shepherd on the left. . ." to correct it, I meant to say the Shepherd on the Right, that makes the "Hook" to this "V".

      I noticed in the final episode of Season one, you found such a symbol in Nova Scotia.

    4. Hello Steve,

      Very interesting research. Warren is my middle name, and comes from my Great Grandmother's line. While doing my research, I noticed that boy's first names, were the last names of the mother's line. I know very little about my father's family, leaving my research to families making up my mother. The line of my mother's father is very interesting, and where I find many familiar names popping up. I seriously doubt that I've any direct DNA relation but, the names are in my tree. My Great Grandmother made claims of being descendant from "royalty and Gods" during her lifetime, and everyone thought she was nuts. After seeing the connections you've made, maybe she wasn't. A detail you may find interest in, my mother's family always seems to be found living in towns with some form of the name "Clair/Clare/Clear" and now that I think about it, "More" and "Mont".

      Does Renee Anjou figure into this, or is that fiction? I found him in my Grandfather's grandmother's line.

      The checker pattern hides the line of the Solstice. See: "Stellar Theology & Masonic Astronomy" Robert Hewitt Brown (page, 82)
      I've usually seen the pattern inside of buildings. I'd never seen it in the open air before. Seems like Yourself, and Scott were walking through a "hidden church" with no walls or ceiling. Only a guess, as only a brief glimpse was given in the episode.

      Best regards,


    5. Hi Anthony,
      Your note prompted me to make you a video response. It's above, at the bottom of the blog post.
      Thanks for pointing out that chequy pattern right under our feet in Tomar.

    6. Steve,

      In response to your video...WOW!!! The connections abound. I wonder if the chequy pattern square in Tomar is an acre in measurement??? If you pause your video at 2:11 you'll notice a certain "light box" at Castle Acre, which is also present a Rosslyn Chapel. If it's the same principle, September 17th should be the important date. Based upon what I remember reading in "Rosslyn Revealed"(Butler, Ritchie) and in a secret article on Alan Butler's, "City of the Goddess" website. You'll have to ask Alan how to access the article. I don't wish to make this public, as it pertains to symbolism of a sensitive nature.

      THANK YOU!!! For showing me Castle Acre. I've never seen the chequy pattern on the side of a building before. It reminds me of the stonework at New Grange, with the rounded black stones. Makes me wonder if this hides the line of shadow cast by a celestial light other than the Sun. Something I'll be pondering for a while. Parts remind me of the reddish/orange rounded stone above the Master Mark Stone in the Newport Tower, and a seemingly similar motif, I recently noticed in a photo of Stonehenge.

      Tomar is most definitely an open air Temple. There seems to be two different sundials. One is the Statue at the center, which should denote the spot where the Summer and Winter Solstice cross. The other seems to be the tip of the church clock. The whole thing should be laid out starting in the Northeast corner. Using a suntracker app, one should be able to determine the significant spots. I'm not sure which way that clock faces but, if the "Mary" is taken as the Eagle constellation, and "Jesus" as the Lion...There's 2 of the 4 fixed signs of the zodiac. I'll leave it to others to debate which ones the other two represent. The Eagle and the Lion...why does this sound familiar...the principle symbols of two specific nations. I'll stop here before I ramble.

      Does the chequy pattern start with William Warenne?

      Thanks for showing me Acre,

      Anthony Warren

      Suddenly very proud to sign my middle name. Thank you Steve!

    7. Hello Steve,

      Here is a link to a photo of Castle Acre. Not only is the chequy pattern, and "light box" visible from your close ups in the video, there is another "light box". Look at the arch to the left side of the photo. There was some serious astronomy built into this place. Very sad to see it in its present state. Must've been a magical place. WOW!!!

      Best regards,

      Anthony Warren

    8. Chequey Pattern-

      The floor of Solomon’s Temple had a Chequey Pattern.
      Did you notice the 3 pillars in the window above the chequey floor Pattern on the Chapel wall?


    9. There's nothing accidental about the castle design. Thanks for the link but, the "NWO" began July 4, 1776. I don't see a Democratic World Commonwealth as a "bad thing" or anything sinister. The only way mankind will ever reach full potential, will be to come together as ONE people. Every person, ONE voice. Look at what a handful of minds have accomplished on this blog, and the connections made. Now, just imagine what could be accomplished with everyone involved as ONE mind.

      I've attached a couple of links to photos of New Grange. I wanted to let everyone know why the chequy pattern came to mind. Notice the black and white stones above the "light box". Sure reminds me of Castle Acre.

      Due to personal reasons, I may not be keeping up with the conversation. I hope I've at least contributed a little food for thought.

      Best regards,

      Anthony Warren

  2. OMG --- this is going to take some time to digest. including the link above. I'm printing off the pages now to sit on the couch with my note pen.

    This is going to be a wonderful trip.......

    1. Hi Explorer Dave,
      I’m looking forward to hearing what you think of the research. Let me know if it causes you to fall asleep :)

  3. Hi Steve, and good idea about blog-host sharing, Scott.

    This is all pretty interesting from my own personal perspective. By fluke, I was into genealogy back about forty years ago while stationed in Italy. I went back to the late 1700's in some cases. I participated in a DNA project about ten years ago, too, and both approaches showed that I have pretty much nothing but Viking and Templar bloodlines, considering my personal DNA profile--it shows nothing but NW European extraction, so this noble/ignoble tainting is unavoidable, at least ...or at best.

    Steve, my own name, Voyles, is Walsh. I have Scandinavian ancestors and English, Scottish, and French ancestors "out of Canada." I myself presently look like an aged Templar warrior, at six feet and a not-so-trim 230 lbs. What am I saying?

    My spirit is with you in your search. I'm still not exactly sure about the Zeno Narratives as historical documents, but I recently read about finding the lime production furnaces connected with building the Newport Tower, and that is impressive, since they were apparently built in the same manner as the tower itself...the arches, and at about the same time...around 1370-1400'ish.

    But what should grab you is that they seem to be of medieval Scottish design, and if I remember correctly, Prince Henry Sinclair is thought to be connected in different ways to both Scotland and this American coastal hotspot of medieval activity...the Zeno Narratives aside.

    Anyway, keep pursuing facts and hooking them together. This can lead to a degree of truth, in spite of the inescapable, occasional "bastardization" that must be dealt with when compiling genealogies. You're right, though, DNA doesn't lie.

    Now I know I have a lot to live up to, since I found out my own Viking/Templar pedigree! (In this regard, we can commiserate.) :-)

    1. Hi Sir Gunn !
      Great to be able to interact with you in a friendlier place ;)

      Interesting that your line goes back to Scandinavia and possibly England.

      If you haven’t done it yet, you might want to find out which SNP tests you can take. They help to zero in on the more recent surnames you connect with.

      The big thing in DNA testing now is Family Tree DNA’s Big Y test. It’s the last DNA SNP test I’ll ever have to take. They’re now connecting the roots of the human tree to the leaves - people alive today are the leaves. It’s wonderful to use such a powerful tool to figure out the truth of our family.

      Talk to you soon,


  4. I am most interested in your research Mr. St. Clair, though I come by the surname through marriage. It's refreshing to see the science highlighted, and knowing that you reject all the Dan Brown Da Vinci Code nonsense as the fiction it was meant to be has me respect you even more.

    Livian Sinclair

  5. Hi Livian,

    Great to meet a distant cousin!

    Thanks very much for your comment. When I first got involved in doing genealogy, I got all the old books from the early 1900s on our family and began trying to figure it all out. They all attempted to connect us back to Rollo in this wonderfully romantic language that I suppose was left over from Victorian times. DNA has changed all that. We now know there are at least 12 distinct lineages in our family. Some don’t share a common ancestor for 3,000 years, others for over 40,000 years.

    Looking into the gifts, land records, etc., and marrying that up with DNA SNP matches has really opened up a whole new era for such research. I’ve been working on the Herdmanston lineage for over 2 years now, and it’s time to get busy on another one very soon. I’ve found a DNA connection and other narratives which might be pointing to something very surprising in our Scottish lineages during the 1600s.

    Talk to you soon,


  6. Ah, you have to love those hard line academics who would rather hold on to flawed history that makes them sleep all cozy at might rather than be true academics and never stop looking.

    Steve, thanks for posting your family research. I myself, am picking up on my maternal lineage where my uncle left off so many years ago. Just when I think I can go back no further (my uncle traced us only as far back as Elizabethan times) and I have thus far taken it back to 1202.

    Folks on both sides of my family were Freemasons, so that's my next big undertaking thanks to being inspired by Scott's book and show. I'm fortunate to finally have the time to do so.

    One little note to Scott: my son (he's 10, has Autism and home schooled) loves your show. It has lit a spark in him and he is now ravenous about history where before, he was just mildly interested. He now says he wants to be a, "Historical Detective." Thanks for inspiring him!

    1. Hi Kristen,
      Thanks for the note. Getting back to 1202 is an amazing accomplishment. Congratulation! It's a rewarding hobby, isn't it?

    2. It definitely is, especially when my son is so excited about it and it relates to my spiritual practice (Heathenry) and my study of Runes (Elder Futhark).

      I'm sure that once I delve in to the Freemasonry connections, I'm going to be met with quite a challenge. I wish I'd begun this particular journey while my father was alive, but it's unlikely I would have found out much. He was very tight lipped about it as well as his time in the Navy as a Cryptologist. At times it feels like one secret starts to peek it's way out and leads to another. :)

  7. What a wonderful idea to host a guest blogger here, Scott! I really enjoy this blog site and the sharing of knowledge and ideas!
    Steve, thank you for sharing your vast research with us!

  8. Hi again, Steve. It's a real shame that the State of Maine doesn't have their precious runestones on display, which to me is a public crime of sorts. I wasted a trip there a few years ago, when I drove up from Boston all for nothing. They said they didn't have room, but at the time they had a very large stone on display taking up a lot of room, and that stone on display was much more of a mystery than the runestones. Clearly, academic bias is tripping up truthful history in Maine. What a shame.

    Anyway, we know for sure that the American runestones in Maine and in Minnesota are linked, by the hooked X. I think this means that the Newport Tower and the KRS are linked, too, especially since one of the Maine Runestones indicates Vinland being two days of sailing south from that spot in Maine, and the KRS party came from Vinland. To me, this is the clearest evidence of where Vinland was located, yet this runestone is hidden away from public view, without an appointment. Why?

    Anyway, I have something to reconcile in my mind, and it has everything to do with understanding the relationship/s between the medieval adventurers up here in MN/SD with those of the East Coast adventurers a mere generation later. What I've seen up here is mostly evidences of Scandinavian sojourning, more specifically, Swedish activity. We see Gotaland clearly--medieval Southern Sweden.

    But, we must make a bridge between Sweden and Scotland, apparently, when bringing the Newport Tower into historical alignment with the KRS. We seem to have had a shifting of Nationalities, or a blending of Nationalities (or families) going on back then, in this apparent connection of Scotland and the East Coast, with the KRS deposited in MN a generation earlier. So, the hooked X is attributable to Swedes and other Scandinavians in 1362 in MN, but the focus of the hooked X then switches over to the East Coast and Scotland a generation later, around 1400, it seems. This is where we need to focus more attention, then.

    I don't think the adventurers on the East Coast were willing to let the far inland circular waterway route (to SD) disappear from their attention...but, which did end up happening. In a nutshell, that's why all the stoneholes and Scandinavian petroglyphs are in that same spot out in the middle of nowhere, because this is where the dwindling oceanic waterways converge.

    I think the East Coast adventurers also were well aware of the KRS party's misadventure in MN just forty years earlier, and they may have been aware of Runestone Hill's geographical significance, too, having been encircled with stonehole rocks for some reason...perhaps because the location in on a direct compass line between Duluth (end of west sailing) and this meeting spot of dwindling rivers in SD.

    Steve, either there was an original blending of ideology between Scots and Swedes at around the time of the KRS, or the blending took place during the ensuing single generation leading up to the East Coast activities, or both occurred. My guess is that there was a mixing up of Swedish and Scottish families, which centered around the hooked X. It seems like there would be more evidence of the hooked X's use in medieval Scotland, besides at Rosslyn. Also, in S. Sweden. A good look into various Scottish and Swedish families co-mingling at this time between 1350 and 1400 could be beneficial, as far as trying to make connections between those who were involved in 1362, with those who were involved around 1400.

    The use of the hooked X was secretive, and much knowledge was lost. The written and verbal records were lost to time, and more tidbits of hidden history are now needed to better understand what went on between the Swedes and Scots during this crucial period of time. I think, ultimately, family research like you're doing may help establish links between the movers and shakers of that time, so that we may have a clearer picture of what happened in America, pre-Columbus. Keep up the important work!

  9. Gunn,

    What people don't realize about the KRS inscription is that all we know for sure is the person who carved the inscription as educated on Gotland and/or southern Sweden. That's all. The rest of the party could have been form elsewhere in Europe.

    Also keep in mind the inscription say "8 Goths (Southern Baltic Region) and 22 Norrmen." "Norrmen" has been translated as "Norwegians", but maybe it means Norrmen and in Norman French? We don't know for sure and have to be very careful about how we interpret the inscription.

    On bad assumption can throw you down the wrong path very quickly and that's happened a lot on the past with the KRS. Multiple nationalities in a Templar/Cistercian party in the 14th century should be expected as it is perfectly consistent with their true ideals.

    1. I'm going to jump in here also. Gunn, one possible connection between the Scots and the Scandinavians is in the parentage of Prince Henry Sinclair. His father was a Scot but his mother was a Norsewoman--it is through her line that Prince Henry ruled in the Orkney Islands as well as in his father's Rosslyn. My guess is that it is thru his mother that Prince Henry acquired maps, charts, oral history ... and, yes, probably the Hooked X ideology.

      In any event, Steve's family research, along with the exciting discovery of the Hooked X on the Westford Knight carving, are important new pieces of evidence that help us reveal this hidden chapter in our history.

    2. Good points David; as is the discovery the Westford Knight Hooked X. I'm still reeling from that one! The fact that it was missed until recently due to the advanced weathering, that is identical to the peck marks of the sword, adds even more credibility to the discovery.

    3. As you first pointed out, Scott, it is not just the advanced weathering of the mark that makes it so compelling. It is also the correct orientation vis-à-vis the rest of the carving and the dots (word separators?) on either side of the X. We know (based on old photos) that the mark predates the first publication of your Hooked X research, which virtually eliminates the possibility of hoax. And we are virtually certain based on your forensic geology work that the mark is manmade and in the shape of a Hooked X. I'm not sure what other conclusion can be reached other than that this mark is authentic. I'd actually like to hear what the skeptics say about this--I don't mean this sarcastically; I honestly and curious to hear if we are missing something here...

    4. David,

      I'm happy to hear from skeptics too, but just saying you don't believe it isn't enough. Please try to be constructive with your queries, not simply dismissive.


    5. I'm not finding any flaws. This research offers tangible proof of what was considered conjecture, and speculation. I'm glad the "maps, charts, oral history" were mentioned. To me, the most fascinating aspect are the people holding special knowledge. Was the "Megalithic Yard" kept alive in secret, or retrieved through excavations??? Rediscovered in public by Dr. Alexander Thom in the 1960's and yet, Mr. Alan Butler has proven the city of D.C. to be laid out using this measurement. FASCINATING!

      In my opinion, astronomical observation was the supreme motivation of going to Jerusalem. Everything else seems to be a cover story. I'm not sure if the purpose was to create new maps, or calibrate older ones. With accurate maps, it's no surprise the Templars became a successful commercial enterprise as quickly as they did.

      Best regards,

      Anthony...apparently...a way distant cousin. Don't worry. I won't hit you up for money. ;~)

    6. I purchased Daniel Merrill's book on Petroglyphs -- has this been used on the Westford Knight

    7. Dave,

      I'm not sure it would work on the Westford Knight/Hooked X as it's a pretty fine and detailed carving. Although we might have to ask Dan about that. Obviously, he would know.

  10. Thanks for the feedback, gentlemen. It seems, then, that Prince Henry Sinclair, all by himself and his Mama, might nicely bridge this "gap" between the Scandinavian and Scottish families we're looking for. This all makes better sense now when we see both Scandinavian and Scottish influences working that we know about the Scottish-appearing medieval lime kilns near the Newport Tower.

    So, the Scandinavians were in that general Vinland area for hundreds of years, but we end up seeing lasting medieval Scottish architecture pop up between 1370 - 1400. Weird. But this does seem to be true. I wonder if there was any Scottish influence with the KRS party? Or, as you mentioned, Scott, the possibility of Norrmen of French extraction being along. It seems like many Frenchmen (and women) may have escaped to Scotland a few generations earlier, as the theory goes. So, I agree with you that it really is difficult to determine just where all the thirty men in the KRS party came from--and especially their bloodlines.

    Actually, we do know where they came from: Vinland. But from there, who knows? Maybe Greenland. And from there, who knows? The various families were busy mixing and spreading out....

    Scott, I agree with you that the KRS runemaster was most likely from that general area you mentioned, and yes, there seems to be a lot of secrecy and mystery over exactly who the party of men were. Much depends on a precise translation of the message on the KRS. I'm basically going on how a lot of the evidences corroborative to the KRS appear to me, like the petroglyphs and war weapons, and that stonehole rock with the flattened top, shaped just like an actual runestone from Gotaland. I'm just saying that many of the MN/SD evidences appear to be quite Swedish, at least in my mind's eye, while some of the East Coast artifacts now appear to have a Scottish influence, at least around the Newport Tower area.

    And the hooked X's we see from both locations are making a nice bridge support, coming together...we see it in the fog....

  11. This is all so fascinating. In researching my own family lines, I recalled reading abt. the Scots mercenary forces traveling, and came across this, though the dates of this Sinclair's adventures may be later than what you were looking for. So I'll toss it in here in case it is at all adding to the conversation

    1. I recall reading that a Sinclair had to fight as a mercenary after paying his share of the ransom for a Scottish king who had been captured by the English. I think he fought in Poland, if memory serves.

  12. After a few days of going through what you have, I accept the thought that I am really out of my league. The history, of course, is just about as fantastic as you could get. It is international, it is verifiable, it represents a good portion of the history of the UK, Europe, and the American continents. It substantiates most everything that I have read of the America's. Your efforts and the efforts of the founders of this website, and the contributors is, without question, what is needed to figure out "what happened".

    And, of course, I ordered a book on "sheep". Who would have guessed......and that's before I get into the books on Washington, D.C.... oh my.......

    And, of course, there is a narrative about the Knight's......"history isn't what we have been taught"....

    1. Thanks very much Dave,
      I'm very glad you're enjoying it.

  13. Hello Steve,

    Just curious, in your family studies, have you come across anyone claiming to be clairvoyant?

    Do you have anymore pictures of "The chequy armorial at Tomar Portugal,
    reminiscent of Warenne or Vaux of county Norfolk, England" you could post? There appears to be a code but, I'd need to see more to say for sure. I really appreciate your time.

    Best regards,

    Anthony Warren

    1. "Code" may have been too strong of a word. I probably should've said, more layers of symbolism. Notice how the tips of the leaves point to two "S" shapes on the side. One points to the middle of the "S" (seems to point to line of cross too), and the other marks two points on the same "S". Reminds me of how Serpent Mound works. I can't tell how many "S" shapes there are, and parts seem like they were intentionally damaged, Makes me wonder what was chipped off??? I also can't tell what's going on in the top corner but, I'm seeing some familiar patterns. Any idea what kind of plant that is supposed to be? My interests are vast and varied but, botany hasn't been one of them.

      The three points marked by the two leaves, taken with the center point of the cross and the line, also reminds me of a lunation triangle. This is interesting because, from what I understand, the chess board can be used as a lunar calendar. The movements of chess pieces are also a scared geometry lesson. One of the videos in the "NWO" link supplied by Pasadena P@ shows this geometry lesson, and portrays it as "Satanic". Sacred Geometry being satanic...I almost fell out of my chair from laughing so hard. I find it extremely sad, some people believe the satanic explanation.

      I probably sound crazy,

      Anthony Warren

    2. Hi Anthony,
      I have quite a few from Castle Acre. Will dig them out and post them on my blog. Will let you know.

    3. As to the Clairvoyant (no relation ;) question, I don't know of any in our family who claim to be.

    4. Hello Steve,

      I only asked about "clairvoyant" because, I heard it used 3 times yesterday. Twice in speech, and once in print. Not a commonly used word, and having "Clair" in it, I thought it might be significant. Seemed coincidental, and I don't believe in coincidences.

      Best regards,

      Anthony Warren

  14. ok, I need to start somewhere -- in going through the DNA sheets of your site, I came to the conclusion that I'm jumping too much.

    Below is a list of books (just some of them) that I'm looking at to just get the idea in my head of the "order" of Scottish, English, Irish, and Wales history. I was going to start with these. I know that I'm looking at months here and sitting on my couch (and really trying not to nod off, hehehe). Scott's and Alan's books are just a start (I have some of them and a real collection of other researchers) and I'm still missing so much of the "history" of the UK, Normandy, etc etc. (I think really a person needs to "live" in the UK's just get a grip but since I don't....)...

    New Edinburgh History of Scotland series -- 4 books, I think
    New Oxford History of England -- 3 books, I think

    is this OVERKILL or what might be your suggestions


    1. Hi Dave,

      Those are good books. I tend to get into more narrowly focused books, like the series called "Proceedings of the Battle Conference," edited by Christopher Harper-Bill and published by Boydell & Brewer. They publish every year. Each book is a collection of papers presented that year.

      The actual list of books is huge.

      Check out anything by John Horace Round, a total expert on Medieval England.

      Your best bet is to look at the sources under many pages of my website or go to this general source page -

      Thanks for your note,


  15. When they were in the church in Portugal there were eight windows and eight colum's
    and a 5 point star? Could this be 8 windows lighting & 8 colum's supporting a 5 star symbol and just remember the importance of 13 hmmmmmm 5 + 8 = 13 revelant?

  16. Hello Steve,

    I came across the following article, which mentions de Warenne DNA. Are you familiar with this line of research?

    Best regards,

    Anthony Warren

    1. Funny I came across the Warren name as being very important in the knight templar freemason version in early US history in New England

  17. Steve,

    Amazing article first off, very well written and outstanding evidence. My question is you mention this SNP DNA testing in your article, upon a quick google I see several places offering this service. What company/organization would you recommend to have this done? I have a decent history of my family dating back to the late 17th century, however I do not have any for my mothers side. Any help would be greatly appreciated!

  18. Steve,

    Great article! very good read thank you so much for sharing your research. I have one question, Where or who would you recommend going to to get this SNP DNA testing? I'm very curious at this point as I have extremly limited knowledge for my mothers side (predominantly english) origins. Any help would be greatly appreciated, thanks!


    Scott + Steve --- is this DNA proof of two~way contact more than 500 years before Pocahontas and maybe even 450 to 500 years before Columbus's voyages!?!! With any luck, we will find more cultural links between Clovis/Folsom + Solutrean designs! We already know the reaction to the KRS despite the fact that trade happens over great distances!

  20. Scott and Steve, great work on the last season together. I am curious as to why no one ever pointed out that Narrangesett Rune Stone was in front of land controlled in Mellon family heir- as in a very important energy/banking family? There is also a sinclair family legacy in Rhode Island itself and based on my research all this stuff is tying in with the same old underground family names that most people never talk about. Who are the robber barron families vs the real carriers of the grail?

    1. Chris,

      There is no positive connection between Mellon and the Narragansett Rune Stone; he removed it because he was annoyed by people wanting to see it and crossing his beach. he handled is very poorly, but thankfully he returned it essentially unharmed.

      I examined it last summer and it's fine; it should be placed on display in a protected place later this year.

    2. Hi Scott, you knew the historic banking/energy Mellon family has been involved with Viking/templar type stuff before right? his father

  21. ChrisTemplar,

    I knew a little bit about the Mellon legacy, but Tim has an attitude that I can't stomach. In the end, things turned out well, but I have hard time believing he had a change of heart and wanted to do the right thing. I would be great if I was wrong.

  22. Has there been any link to the hook in the X to represent a female child? Since it is a v withing a V of the female position? I have long suspected this and brought to the US.

  23. Art Vape,

    Yes, this is exactly what I wrote in my Hooked X book in 2009. The little "v" does represent the daughter some believe was named Sarah, in side the womb (big "V") of here mother Mary Magdalene.

  24. Scott... prior to EMMA OF NORMANDY's passing in 1052 or even the birth of Robert of Normandy's son William in 1028 we encounter KING CANUTE and a child's tale
    that is a political fable that encompasses a folk history about the North Sea Empire between 1016 and 1035. To now explain what happens a half century later between 1066 and 1085 one has to be reminded that Ethelred the Unready is the father of a very saintly Edward the Confessor and that Harold Godwinson lucks into the throne because of the oath the Confessor had his nobles take. The royal marriages of the time indeed imply 1066 saw a battle royal happen on English soil between distant cousins, but somehow in the middle of this Gotland on the other
    side of Sweden from Denmark is prospering. Cnut is the father of Harthacnut, the young prince's mother had been the wife of Ethelred until his untimely death, for Emma of Normandy marries Canute after he conquers most of England. I think the politics of the North Sea Empire is a backdrop... as is any map that shows us all where Old Gutnish is spoken. I see even where the Crimea is brought into things, and WHY Gotland is and has its own dialect, but very centrally located. Prior to 1066 we have the curious shifts of power in the string of Anglo-Saxon kings whose names often begin with the letter "E" and the brief time-frame when Cantute brings
    a "C" into things in a Northern manner. He had quite a control over trade and small
    coastal islands. Jutes are often in Denmark or living near Danes, but Gutes are to
    be found on that island you are very aware of! Like WWI we can find royal cousins
    having troops who fight in opposition! Prior to the Great Schism the Church unifies...

  25. Goths, Gutes and Jutes... yes.
    Crimean Gothic suggests rivers
    and trade. Gotland thrives due
    to trade routes. Jutes do enter
    English history. Cnut is often
    Anglicized as Canute. To whit,
    when Shakespearian actors do
    portray Hamlet brilliantly, they
    often act the way a well born
    Jute or Dane would or could at
    a court as by custom and habit.

    Scott... they must look at a map.
    The North Sea Empire's history
    is part of this riddle as is how
    Visby falls in 1361 most tragically.
    As Kynge Canute did see, history
    hath its tides. Having a sense of
    history often helps immensely...
    Of course they have blinders on
    in terms of the KRS and its runes.
    Admittedly I have mayhap a passing
    awareness of Auld English basically.
    J.R.R.Tolkien in his day was quite
    the scholar and had liked the sagas...

  26. Hello:
    How do I email Scott a pic of a stone I found?

  27. When studying the Newpirt Tower you mention the notched keystone. I also noticed above the keystone is a round or circular stone right above the keystone. Any sugnifigance

  28. Tommy,

    In my Hooked X book I mentioned the round, red granite boulder above the notched keystone could be symbolic of either the sun, or Venus which is red when it first rises through the atmosphere. It's not an accident that it's directly above that important keystone.

  29. I have been researching my rumored Native American heritage. I have been able to find the immigrant in all of my blood lines except for one. My 3X grandfather in that blood line was born in Virginia (before it split) in 1799. My 3X grandmother was born in Pennsylvania in 1805 and by 1830 they were both living just north of the Serpent Mound in Ohio. By 1870 those who were still living had moved near Clements Minnesota bring with them my Ohio born great grandmother. As a child I was told that I was 1/4 Norwegian and 3/4 apparently my family members had some sort of weird thing for Indians??? The Lower Sioux Community in Morton Minnesota is not too far from Clements...or I am part Shawnee Indian - the movements from state to state coincide with the Indian Removal Acts. I have had my DNA tested by and these are the results:

    Europe West 46%
    Europe East 28%
    Scandinavia 16%
    Great Britain 5%
    Finland/Northwest Russia 2%
    Ireland 2%
    Caucasus < 1%

    I reran my raw DNA through and get these world view results:

    Pygmy -
    West-Asian 7.89%
    North-European-Mesolithic 4.11%
    Indo-Tibetan -
    Mesoamerican 0.71%
    Arctic-Amerind -
    South-America_Amerind -
    Indian 1.14%
    North-Siberean -
    Atlantic_Mediterranean_Neolithic 27.22%
    Samoedic -
    Indo-Iranian 1.56%
    East-Siberean -
    North-East-European 55.16%
    South-African -
    North-Amerind 0.92%
    Sub-Saharian -
    East-South-Asian -
    Near_East 0.99%
    Melanesian 0.09%
    Paleo-Siberian -
    Austronesian 0.23%

    So my question is: How does a German/Norwegian end up with Middle East results on one and Mesoamerican on the other?

  30. Sir, I am trying to find out if any known people ever made false teeth from quartz crystal. I am finding, on an almost perfect dome hill, stones that appear to have been formed by hand. The kicker is, that if these are indeed false teeth, some of these people had to be giants. Crystals shaped exactly the same, and the size of a child's fist.

  31. John,

    I am not aware of quartz ever being used for false teeth. If you had pictures of what you're looking at I might be able to provide some additional input.

  32. I have a direct lineage to Hugh De Payens but need someone who has expertise to verify the validity--possibly by DNA. Please see momdeborah52 at

  33. My history is linked to the "Broun" Family. Where does one take the DNA Test to reveal a nexus to the St. Claire Family? I would assume certain markers would manifest in such a test. Thank you for your attention to this important matter. With Kind Regards, Robert B. Walker.

  34. Hi Robert. See and click the "Contact" link. I'll be happy to add you to our DNA study.
    Steve St. Clair

    1. Steve, I think you and Scott would find some interesting family connections to the wife of Thomas Douglas, 5th Earl of Selkirk, who was Jean Wedderburn-Colville. Thomas Douglas and 22 Norwegians in 1817 built the Norway House on the banks of the eastern channel of the Nelson River in Manitoba. Coincidences surrounding the Norway house abound and whether they are just creative speculation or substantiated clues, the trails lead back to even more connections. Such is one perhaps purely coincidental example that the Norway House Cree's tribal crest is of a York Boat/Orkney Yole centered with the mast reaching up through the sun, kind of like what the suspected Norse sun compass would look like. That then leads to the syllabary Cree writting created in 1840 which I feel is more similar to the Yarmouth runes in Nova Scotia than futhark would be, and again coincidentally, Thomas Douglas and Dr. Richard Fletcher, the finder of that stone, were both in Nova Scotia around the same time. In 1811, Dr. Fletcher was one of the original stock holders in the "Inland Navigation Co" Anyway, all coincidence, but in the middle of all of them is the the wife to Thomas Douglas, 5th Earl of Selkirk and also perhaps the many times great grand daughter of the Henry I Sinclair who has a monument in Guysborough to his pre-Columbian landing approximately 1 degree north in Latitude of Yarmouth Stone. Anyway, thought you may be interested, Cheers, Scott Lund